Unsigned518 - Episode 147 - P. Gutter

[00:00:01] Speaker A: He was born on a Saturday in. [00:00:03] Speaker B: 73 he loves far cry music 19 jabbing in the dazzle jazz it's motherfucking Andy scolding. Look at motherfucker, cuz. Here it comes. Andy scaring his orange hats. [00:00:27] Speaker C: Welcome to unsigned 518. I am here with P. Gutter. How's it going? [00:00:32] Speaker A: It's going good, man. Good to be here. [00:00:33] Speaker C: Yeah, it's good to have you here. And I guess, you know, we talked a little bit before we got rolling, but basically, I want you to be able to tell your story the way that you want to tell it. I don't do research on my guests other than the music. So I don't. You know, I'm not one of those people that's gonna be like, hey, tell me about the time that this happened, because I researched it. So, like, it's up to you, I guess, to tell the story. [00:01:01] Speaker A: Absolutely. [00:01:02] Speaker C: Mike's all yours, I guess. [00:01:03] Speaker A: All right, cool. So, yeah, so I guess I'll start out by saying, just to give context, I definitely started out with aspirations, you know, of being over, being a recording artist, being a rapper. But I had. I had inspirations in music. I would say people like. Like a Russell Simmons, Master P, you know, Sean Puffy Combs, people who they were in the music business, but showed us how many different ways you can make money. [00:01:48] Speaker C: Right. They were almost like talent scouts in. In some way, you know? [00:01:52] Speaker A: Yeah. So definitely, definitely. Master P was probably the biggest blueprint because he came at it from an independent standpoint. And I felt like it's. It's important for me to highlight that aspect of it because no matter how much I collaborate with other record labels, be them independent or major, I'm always trying to maintain as much independence and control over my situation as possible. So to. Probably the best way to start out will probably be from my very first album, of course. Of course, there's a lot of training and everything that led up to that, but I felt like. I feel like that's probably the best place to start because that's the start of me implementing everything that I experienced and learned up to that point and really started putting it into action. So the very first professional release project I put out was in 2004, and it was a project called Hood Life. And at that time, I was actually known as Poverty. So, you know, I grew up in Albany and people got to know me as that name, and that name was actually an acronym, and it stood for Poetic Outspoken Verses Effectively Reaching the Youth. And I felt like that name really Embodied everything that I stood for as far as I was definitely a self made person who didn't come from much, but knew how to do a lot with a little. So even though I didn't have a lot of money, I always knew how to make it look good. And then like I said, each one, each one of those things in that acronym really made up who I was as a person, but also the message that I wanted to stay constant in the music. So, you know, growing up in, you know, the Arbor Hill section of Albany, New York, I was really, grew up right in the, as they say, the trenches. You know, I was in the. I was, I was exposed, you know, to everything. But I always had kind of a different perspective in a way that I looked at to where I was. I was like from the street, but not in the street. I could, you know, if that, if that makes sense. And people, you know, people who live in impoverished neighborhoods and ghettos and hoods don't understand, you know, say, when I put it that way, right, you know. Yeah, you know, like, yeah, I sold drugs, but I wasn't like a drug kingpin, you know what I'm saying? Like, I wasn't, I wasn't supplying, I wasn't supplying the area or anything like that. It's like I was doing what broke people did, you know what I'm saying? It's like you, you had whatever type of job or income or whatever, but it wasn't enough to sustain you. [00:05:11] Speaker C: Right. [00:05:11] Speaker A: You know what I'm saying? So you supplemented. [00:05:14] Speaker C: That's, that's exactly the word that I was gonna say. I'm like, sometimes you gotta supplement. I don't know, you know, like. [00:05:22] Speaker A: Different ways. I'll put it that way. Yeah. So some, like, some, some people, some people knew me, you know, from, from music. Some people knew me from being my customer or what have you. But it was like, when I put out, when I put out that project Hood Life, it was like all the, all the, all the worlds that I was a part of, all the, all the different circles that I was a part of, like it all came together in that project. Cause now once I'm now presenting them with this physical copy of a body of work, now they're like, oh, he's, he's really, he really is an artist. He's not, you know, he's not just standing, you know, on the corner like rapping and freestyling. It's like he's, he's really got something serious going on. [00:06:16] Speaker C: If you're going back to like, 2004, like, even just like the difference, you know, we're talking 20 years. Like, it doesn't sound like a ton, but like to put out something physical back then, right, it has to be different than what's going on now. [00:06:31] Speaker A: Way different. [00:06:32] Speaker C: It was harder, you know, it was harder to get that. Like now, like, I mean, you want a fucking cd, like, you know, I'll go on the Internet and I can scream into my cell phone, send an MP3 to a company and get a physical CD. Like, you couldn't do that back then. Like, so, like what was the, what was the struggle to get it actually physical? You know. [00:06:57] Speaker A: So obviously there's the, there's the financial part, number one. So the financial part period, like you said, you're talking about now it being 2024. And where was technology at in 2004 versus 2024 to where, like you said, just even being able to record an album, like, how much harder was it to record an album in 2004 versus now? So there was that aspect. So where I had a little bit of an advantage was I did have a music mentor. So my music mentor was known affectionately to the Capitol district as Drew. So Drew was from Buffalo, New York, and his full, his full name was Charles Andrew Stitt and his brother is Levi Ruffin. So Levi Ruffin was one of the members of Rick James Stone City Band. So Drew's connection to the music industry, the real music industry, right, was very strong. So like his, his brother would actually come into, when he would visit, he would visit his brother obviously, and he would come into the, to the sessions. So me and Drew actually ended up becoming like business partners to where he was a, he was a sound engineer, a studio engineer. Taught me how to become a studio engineer and a real producer. And we would actually start tag teaming on sessions. You know, like, he would book sessions and he might do the first half, I might finish the second half and vice versa. And then his brother would come into town and really from a music standpoint, I'm talking about like, from like instruments, like helping me advance and become a better musician and actually putting my hands on keys and things like that. And we're talking about somebody who has, you know, Grammys and American Music Awards and stuff. And he's just kicking it with us and laughing and telling jokes, you know, and stories about Rick James and stuff, and on the road and stuff. And it's like, did you ever meet Rick James? No, never met Rick James. Actually, when Rick James passed, my partner Drew was actually one of the pallbearers. [00:09:31] Speaker C: Oh, no way. [00:09:32] Speaker A: For his funeral. Yeah. So that's kind of like a inclination of how my man's just shutting. Showing off right now. [00:09:40] Speaker C: People can't see it, but Calvin might. Every once in a while, my dog will, like, fall in love with a guest. And, like, this shit happens where, like, no matter what I do, he's like, no, I'm hanging out with him. [00:09:49] Speaker A: I think it's because, like, I don't have any animals at home, so he's not, like, even sensing any competition. [00:09:55] Speaker C: He's getting. I could. I could see it was coming too. He's, like, looking there and he's like, huh, I wonder if I just jump up there. Hey, Calvin, buddy. [00:10:02] Speaker A: He's like, officially stop the whole thing. [00:10:07] Speaker C: Yeah, he's. He's usually not this up in the guest business, but he likes you. [00:10:14] Speaker A: I'm saying, as long as he sangs out, like, he's cool. He's not bothering me. There he goes. [00:10:21] Speaker C: He's like, I'll lay down everything. Well, because, you know, and one of the things, like, going back to, like, what you were saying about, like, you know, Master P and, like, how, like, they were, like, cultivating. Rick James was certainly in that same camp of, like, he wasn't just a, hey, make me come up here. And everybody else, like, he was someone that brought, you know, would find people, be like, that person's talented. Let's get them, you know? And he's from Buffalo, right? [00:10:46] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. No, no. 100%, so. So, yeah. So that's what I mean is, like, me being exposed to all of that and being in the Capitol District was rare. Like, an anomaly like that. That's not the makeup of our area. We don't have that kind of access to people in the music industry who. Who are really at that level. We unfortunately had a lot of people and still do in our area who professed to be hold those types of positions in the music industry. And then once the curtain is pulled back, then we see, you know, there really is no wizard. This guy has no. This guy has no power. Right. And for me, that wasn't the case. I really had somebody who understood that music was a business and needed to be treated that way at all times. Unfortunately, Drew was somebody who was deeply in the game, but he was in the game enough, you know, to be done wrong, you know, to be. To be hurt by the music business and had deep, you know, deep wounds and, you know, scars that hadn't healed. And he just took the position of, I'm never going to let anybody come into my studio and record and not have the knowledge and the tools that they need to protect themselves. So that was also another advantage. Leg up that I had on other people was I wasn't just coming to the studio to record. I was coming to the studio to be educated. [00:12:35] Speaker C: Because most people, you know, would just maybe sit in the studio or be like, ah, let the producer do their thing. [00:12:43] Speaker A: Yeah, I'm just hearing. [00:12:44] Speaker C: Yeah. And then they do whatever. [00:12:47] Speaker A: So that's like. [00:12:48] Speaker C: She would take it as a learning opportunity and, like. [00:12:51] Speaker A: And that's literally like, how my session was. Like, you know, a friend of mine had, you know, knew that I was looking for, you know, a producer, a place to record. You know, it's. It's Albany. That's. We don't really have any places and stuff like that or, you know, people that I. That I trust that it's gonna come out, you know, the way that I want to. So I'm. I'm. I'm putting my feelers out. So I actually did have a friend of mine shout out to DJ Dot. He did have a connection, you know, with Master P and no Limit. And he was. He was traveling back and forth, you know, out there, so he would come back with more information from us. And he was like, man, he was like, if you. If you're really ready to take this seriously, he's like, you need to. You need to go out to North Albany and hook up with my man Drew, because, you know, he's the guy that you need. So, you know, again, I'm just going there. I'm ready to rap, and I get there. And so, you know, you do the same kind of thing. Like, when we got here, you know, we did the formalities and just sat and kicked it for a while to get a feeling for each other or whatever. I'm like, all right. And then we're gonna record. We're gonna record a song, and then my man comes out with a book. And I don't. I know it was written by Donald Passman and was like. It's like either like, everything you need to know about the music industry or all you need to know about the music industry. And he's like, yeah. He was like, I want you to read this book. And I'm like, what? [00:14:17] Speaker C: Right now? [00:14:18] Speaker A: What's with. Yeah, like, what. What's going on? But then, like. But just like I told you, that's what he tells me. He's like, look, he's like, you know, I've got 15 years in the music industry, and this thing that you're saying you want to be a part of, you know, it ain't just rapping and singing and making music. He's like, it's full of people who wish you ill will, and you need to protect yourself. And the only way you're gonna be able to protect yourself is to get the knowledge to protect yourself. So he was like, this book has all the information in it that you need to at least get a foundation. And then he added, and I'm not going to record you until you finish this book. So now I'm like, bro, I'm here with my bread. Like, my money, whatever money I scrounged together, you know what I'm saying? Whether it was legally or illegally, I was like, I got my bread. I'm ready to record. And this guy is talking about, I am not going to take your money and record you until you read this book. I'm like, who? Who did DJ dude send me to? [00:15:30] Speaker C: Fucking Mr. Miyagi shit, you know? [00:15:33] Speaker A: Right? [00:15:33] Speaker C: He's like, go out and wax my car. [00:15:35] Speaker A: Yeah, right, right, right. [00:15:36] Speaker C: What the fuck? [00:15:37] Speaker A: So I'm like. I was like, except for the fact of the. That he. He played the things that came out of that room, right? He played me the music that came out of that room, which was like, I do want that. That is the level of quality that I want. But I don't want to have to go through this book to get to that recording. Yeah, but he was. He was not playing around. He was dead serious about it. So he was like, yeah. He was like, yeah, we're not recording nothing today. Here's this book. And, yeah, call me when you're done with the book, and then we'll have a session and stuff like that. And he was like, and don't play yourself, because I'm going to quiz you on the book, and if I can see that you really didn't read it, then I'm going to send you back out until you really read the book. But that. You all right, buddy? You fall asleep? [00:16:42] Speaker C: I think he did. He was like. Now it looks like he's all, like, embarrassed. So you read the book, right? [00:16:55] Speaker A: So, yeah, I recorded an album with Drew. So, yeah, I definitely. I read the book, but in reading the book, it was like. It just opened my brain to this whole new. [00:17:06] Speaker C: And was it, like, a lot of, like, legal sides of the business or like. [00:17:10] Speaker A: Well, yeah. So the way that the book is constructed, it's. It's. [00:17:13] Speaker D: It's like. [00:17:13] Speaker A: It's A lot of stories. So it's a lot of stories, this. [00:17:16] Speaker C: Could happen to you type of thing. [00:17:18] Speaker A: Right, right. So it was like a. It was like a personal account of, like, what this guy went through in the music business and, like, you know, like, the peaks and valleys and the pitfalls and the traps. And so it's like, it's not. It's not mundane reading. Like, there really is, like, a story going on. It's not just a bunch of legal jargon. [00:17:37] Speaker C: Right. [00:17:37] Speaker A: You know what I'm saying? That that helps kind of draw you into, but it's an introduction of what you're getting yourself into, which is the. Is what. I try to let that be my conversation with people who see the success that I've had, and they come to me almost, like, for a consultation, and I kind of try to make it broader than music. When I'm talking to them, I'm like, music. Music is a business. This is. Or treated or a career, you know, that you want to go into. And I said, whenever you're. You're deciding that, you know, there's a business or a career that you want to do, like, you really need to do real research on what this thing really is versus what you believe it to be, because once you find out what it really is, you might realize, oh, I thought I wanted to do that. But what this thing really is, like, nah, I don't want to do that. [00:18:33] Speaker C: I mean, that could probably apply to any. Like, you could take what you just said and, like, apply to anything. Like, oh, I love baking bread. I want to be a bread baker. Then you look into it and you're like, ah, shit. Like, you know, how many hoops you got to go through to, like. [00:18:46] Speaker A: Right? And I was like, nah, I'll just keep going to the bakery. I make bread that bad? Yeah, yeah. So that. [00:18:52] Speaker C: So the music's just a piece of it then. [00:18:54] Speaker A: Exactly. So it was like, with that being my introduction, you know, to really making music, like, on a professional level. It's like, I want everybody to have a chance to have that kind of introduction to music, because that's the real introduction versus, you know, the music videos. And now, you know, like I said, 2004 music videos. Now it's social media, you know, YouTube, and, you know, everything that we're shown that's not real, you know, we're shown the show, and it's like, every show, you know, ends, and then there's the real life that happens. So it's like. But they never show you that, you know, because that's behind the scenes and. Yeah, because the, and it's not. And it's not glamorous and it's not enticing. You know what we're always looking at, we're looking at sales pitches, you know what I'm saying? So a sales pitch is going to give you all benefits, you know, and no disadvantages. They're not gonna, you know, they're not gonna show you the bad, they're gonna show you the good stuff. So I just, I always. Because it's usually young people that's coming to me who don't have any guidance, who don't have a mentor. So I'm like, I don't have time to be your mentor or nothing like that, but I can at least give you like a realistic place to start. [00:20:12] Speaker C: And I mean, sometimes just a couple of sentences. [00:20:14] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:20:15] Speaker C: Telling someone, you know, a few words can exactly. Can be enough for like, it makes sense and like they start to see the light, you know, Even if you just say, you know, a couple things like watch out or protect yourself. [00:20:27] Speaker A: And that's what I was going to say. When you're saying stuff like that, it's. [00:20:31] Speaker C: Showing like it's not all gumdrops and. [00:20:35] Speaker A: That you like it, that you give a fuck about somebody besides yourself, you know what I'm saying? Like, that's not, that's not a self serving conversation, you know. So I had a, I have a, I had a consultation just this past week, you know, with, with. I think it was. It. Well, it was, it was actually, it was actually. It was a manager of art. It wasn't an artist, it was a manager of an artist. But he could tell right away, like from our conversation, he was like, this guy's different, you know what I'm saying? Because be. Because he ended up contacting me based on the success that he saw happening with my page. Not, not what I'm posting. But the, the engagement of my posts is like this, this guy has, has real stuff going on. He's throwing this is not Smoking Marriage. Yeah. Where he's just, you know, he's just throwing stuff on, you know, on Instagram or whatever and just getting people to click on it. He's like going through like he said, like he, he did his homework and he was like, nah. He's like, this guy really has good, real stuff going on. So he reached out to me. But my first conversation with him, most conversations that go from like a, in Instagram or social media to a phone conversation, usually the person that you contacted that person has the upper hand because you contacted them. And in the music industry is. It's like this. This conversation is going to lead to some type of me asking for a payment for some type of service. Music business is transactional. It's not a bunch of friends hanging out. Once you get to the point of I do this for money, everybody involved is like, it's transactional. So no matter how much fun we're having, you know what I'm saying, doing this, like, this is a. This is a transactional relationship. And they're used to, you know, those, Those conversations. By the end of a conversation, it's a. And this is my fee. [00:22:45] Speaker C: Right. [00:22:47] Speaker A: But our conversations didn't lead to a fee because that's not. That's obviously what. Eventually you're going to need to receive some type of revenue, some type of income. But my whole thing is I don't need to get it from the people who are coming to me who are just looking for information. You know what I'm saying? If you want me to actually do a record, yeah, there's a fee attached to that. You know what I'm saying? But if you're just. If you're literally just trying to, like, form, like, some type of relationship with me to where I can be a person that you can come to be, like, hey, I just want to run this by you. It's like, I don't have to charge you a fee of that now. If you want an actual, like, consultation, like, I'm gonna be right. Like, doing a deep dive. Yeah, if I'm doing, like, a deep dive, a consultation, like, helping you build your business. Yeah, there's a consultation fee, and it's. And it's really not really based on the information as much as it's based on the time, because I. Because I really do do this right. You know what I'm saying? So it's like if. If I'm. If I'm setting aside this amount of time and I'm gonna only be focused on you, and that's going to be taken away from all the other things that I do to get money. Yeah, you're gonna. You're gonna have to supplement that. That money that I would, you know, say, would have been making somewhere else. But as far as, you know, just. Just doing DMs back and forth and stuff like that. It's like. It's like, no, like, I want you, I want everybody who has the same goals. I want us all to be able to win. And if. [00:24:20] Speaker C: And I mean, I Do the same, like with this podcast, you know, I mean, I've, I'm on. I've done more than 200 episodes of it all local musicians. And like, I have people reaching out to me all the time that, you know, I have a show coming up. Who, you know, who could possibly play with this? Or I need a, you know, fill in guitarist or I need something. You know, people reach out to me all the time. And I was like, I like, you know, helping. It's just a couple of tech. But if someone was like, hey, I need this, you know, I need, I want you to produce this thing. And it's gonna take me hours and you know, then. But what you said about how everything else goes to the wayside, that's what resonated with me. Because I'm like, if I like need to stop fucking everything, right, and do this, then it's gonna cost. [00:25:05] Speaker A: It's gonna cost. Like time is. Time is the number one commodity on the planet. [00:25:11] Speaker C: Yeah. Especially at my age. [00:25:15] Speaker A: Right. So I can see it so going so to kind of like, you know, circle back and sum up like what we're saying. It's like I wanted everybody to have a chance to have the same type of introduction to the music industry that I had. Now it's up to that individual, how serious, you know, they're going to take it. And a lot of times I know that I'm actually scaring people away who are, who after that conversation are probably never going to come back to me again because, again, because I'm not sales pitching them. [00:25:47] Speaker C: Right? [00:25:47] Speaker A: You're getting what I'm saying. I'm not, I'm not telling them the attractive things that they want to hear. That's going to be like, yes, this is exactly what I want to be doing. You know what I'm saying? And I'm not, you know, like, I'm not, I'm not helping feed their pipe dream, right? And to some people I know, it's like I'm busting their bubble with all this reality and that's in that. [00:26:07] Speaker C: Would they rather find out from you? [00:26:09] Speaker A: Right? [00:26:09] Speaker C: Would they rather put in fucking, you know, years of work and all this stuff and then find out? [00:26:14] Speaker A: You know, I'll tell you the crazy thing though. It is that kind of like caught in the Matrix mentality, though some people would rather live in the Matrix. There's like in, in, in this fake reality, you know, I'm a superstar and I'm gonna, you know, I'm gonna be rich and famous one day. All I have to do is keep doing this thing that I'm doing right now, even if in reality, we know that thing that you're doing is never going to get you to where you're saying you want to go. And that's who, you know, who's real and who's not. The people that are thankful and, you know, have gratitude for that real information you're giving them. I'm like, oh, that's. That's really the way I'm going to make it happen. They come back. Those are the people. [00:26:54] Speaker C: They just readjust their plan. [00:26:55] Speaker A: Yeah, those are the people that, you know, okay. They really are serious about turning this dream into a reality. And I feel like my life is the perfect example for people in this area to look at as someone who has many dreams and has turned many dreams into reality. And that's the value that I know I bring to any situation that I'm put into. And I have that confidence about that because I know I've done the real stuff. You know what I'm saying? I'm not just out here flexing on social media. I don't even show you a fraction of what I'm really doing behind the scenes, because I know that's not. Number one, that's not what people want to see. And number two, it's like, it's none of your business. [00:27:51] Speaker C: Give away the secret. [00:27:53] Speaker A: I've been fortunate enough to gain some great relationships in the music business with people who are real. You know, they're. They're major players, and they've let me so far into their lives on a personal level. It's like this. The stuff that I'm doing with these people, like, it's not for the public. So I can. I can just make a post and say, hey, you know, working with this person. But I can't show you what our. What our day was. That day. It was. It was too personal. It wasn't. You know, I'm saying it. It wasn't for you. It was. It was for. It was for me. [00:28:28] Speaker C: It wasn't performing. [00:28:29] Speaker A: It was for me, but it wasn't for me to share. [00:28:30] Speaker C: Right. [00:28:31] Speaker A: And. And I believe that I've been able to maintain a lot of relationships that I have in the music industry be. Because. Because I operate that way. Right. And they know, you know, I'm. I'm a. I'm a safe space, you know, for them. For them to let their guard down. Because, you know, I'm saying, we ain't gotta worry about him doing nothing crazy or, you know, just trying to get clout off of my name. And for me, it's like the relationship means way more to me, you know, than the clout thing, 100%. But, yeah. So, yeah, 2004, that was. That was everything that I learned from 1998, when I first walked into Drew's room, all the way to having a physical project completed, a project that I did all the production on, that I. That I co engineered with Drew, that I did the art direction on. The graphics I did. At that time, I wasn't proficient enough at Photoshop to actually do all the graphics, but I was sitting right there with the graphic designer, like, no, this is the way it has to be. I'm not accepting anything else. You know what I'm saying? So I don't know how to get it there, but I need X, Y and Z. So it was literally, it was a project that it was all me. It was all different facets of me. But, yeah, it was called Hood Life. And like I said, my name was poverty at that time. And that was also my introduction to the world, that I'm here to make a contribution to this art form and to show everybody in this town that I'm dead serious about this. So I don't know how long you've been in the area. Do you know about when Strawberries and Music Shack? [00:30:35] Speaker C: Yeah, I mean, a little bit. I moved over here in, like, 2004, down to Troy. [00:30:41] Speaker A: Okay. Wow. That's. That's a. What a coincidence. [00:30:43] Speaker C: Yeah. What a coincidence. Yeah, actually. Well, fuck, I didn't even think. Yeah, so 2004, I moved from Vermont to Troy, so. Yeah, I know, like, a little bit. I did the local music show on EQX when I lived in Vermont. So, like, I. I've been aware kind of tangentially of the local scene, but I wasn't, like, here. I wasn't going to Strawberries and hanging out there. [00:31:10] Speaker A: Yeah. So Strawberries was, like. Right. I know it was, like, in the same block. I'm not sure if it was right next door, but I know it was definitely in the same block. So there was Strawberries and there was Music Shack. So those were the places that if you were, you know, a local or. I wouldn't say local. I just an independent artist. If you were an independent artist, these were places that if you had physical product, you could get your stuff on the shelf and you're still sitting next to all of your other, you know, Main Street. [00:31:47] Speaker C: Like, they didn't separate, like, local and national. Everything was just, like. [00:31:50] Speaker A: It was just Alphabetized. If you. So if you had the same, you know, initials as, as Jay Z stuff would be sitting right next to Jay Z. And then, then also they would do like new releases. So if you were a new release, they would just put you with the new releases. Yeah, so it was like what they did for independent artists locally and abroad was, was awesome because it gave you that same light without, it's like I said, after learning the business, without having to pay the same prices that the artists that was on those major labels, right. What they were paying to be upfront, you know, in the store and distribution. [00:32:29] Speaker C: Even to have the placard, like the little placard separating the CDs, to have like your name like that was a deal made, I'm sure, you know, just. [00:32:38] Speaker A: Like, oh yeah, well, but. So again, but it was about presentation and, and knowing how to approach them as a business owner. I put that album out underneath my own record label. My record label at the time was Upstate Records. And that's, that's what was, you know, all my stuff was barcoded and it said, you know, where it was, where it was quarter, mixed and mastered and you know, distributed by Upstate Records. You know what I'm saying? So it was like everything the way it was packaged was professional. The way I approached the owners of the different, you know, establishments, you know, it was, it was good because those were music shack. Definitely was a mom and pop, you know what I'm saying? So it wasn't like it wasn't a corporation. They had to get approval for them or nothing like that. It was like if you were able to sell the owner on it, then it was in every store that they had. So that's what I mean. But just being able to have a switch to turn on, to turn off, being able to turn off the artist switch and turn on the business owner switch. That's a skill. [00:33:44] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:33:45] Speaker A: That has to be learned and that. [00:33:47] Speaker C: Is usually, you know, given to somebody else to do. You know, people hired someone to do that part of it. [00:33:55] Speaker A: Exactly. [00:33:55] Speaker C: Which is an expense, you know, and like, not only is it a skill to have it, but it's a fucking. Your money saving device. You know what I mean? You don't have to. [00:34:04] Speaker A: Some people, I won't even say some, I'll say the majority other people who, who control, you know, what's going on in music. Men, the people call them gatekeepers, whatever. The business people in the music business do not want to talk to an artist. It's like they don't care if you have that skill set. If you're the artist, you're not. They want. [00:34:22] Speaker C: Artist probably doesn't. [00:34:25] Speaker A: Yeah, they want to talk to your manager. [00:34:26] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:34:26] Speaker A: You know, who can. Who can understand the language. Hopefully he's an experienced manager, so he already knows, you know, the game, the song and dance. You know what I'm saying? So stuff that is, like, you just go over there and be an artist, and me and your manager are going to talk because. But also, you know, unfortunately, a lot of. A lot of business people are lied to by the artists as well. You know what I'm saying? So it's like, there's all different parts of it. It's not all like, you know, we're trying to take advantage of you because you're an artist. It's also because it's like, I need to talk to the business person who's gonna make sure that, you know, you're. [00:35:04] Speaker C: Just two different worlds. [00:35:05] Speaker A: Yeah. It's like, whatever we agree on, like, it's real. They're. The manager's gonna make sure, like, it really happens. Like, you're the artist. Like, you could just go off and get high somewhere and you forgot about the whole conversation, and someone might even. [00:35:16] Speaker C: Come get you and tell you where you need to be and. [00:35:19] Speaker A: Yeah, but that's what I'm. Yeah, so that's what I'm saying. So that's the manager's responsibility to make sure that the artist is where they supposed to be and. And stuff like that. They're not looking at you that way. So there was instances where knowing that some things, I was able to navigate myself and present myself as the artist and the manager. And then sometimes I would have to send somebody else in, even if they weren't contractually my manager or nothing like that. It's like, I know I need somebody to send in as a representative. So I would sit down with the person and game plan and be like, okay, this is what I need to have happen in this meeting. [00:35:55] Speaker C: And what you're doing that basically so that they. So that the people wouldn't look at you as. [00:35:59] Speaker A: Right. [00:36:00] Speaker C: An art. Just an artist or whatever. [00:36:02] Speaker A: Like, yeah, they have. They have a totally different face to look at. [00:36:04] Speaker C: Right. Right. [00:36:05] Speaker A: You know, all I. I'm just sound like, this is. Yeah, this is my manager. So they have no choice, you know, but to believe me. [00:36:10] Speaker C: Right. [00:36:11] Speaker A: But I know it's like I'm still pulling the strings. I just. I just need. [00:36:15] Speaker C: This is all performative for you guys. [00:36:17] Speaker A: You know, I. I need. I need my. I need my wishes To. To come out of a different mouth just so you'll take it seriously. And so I knew, like, what situations I could do myself and when I knew I had to send, you know, somebody else in to do that. [00:36:31] Speaker C: So I think we should probably hear a song. [00:36:34] Speaker A: Absolutely. [00:36:34] Speaker C: Are you down with that? What do we want to play for everybody? [00:36:39] Speaker A: So, yeah, so one of the music videos that I have right out is out right now is for a song called Dollar Bill that was actually features Rick Hyde from a black soprano family. We went down. He actually was living. He's from Buffalo too. So that was the other thing. It was like when the. When the rappers and Griselda, everybody started coming out of Buffalo. Like me not living in Buffalo, but having, you know, those ties to people that came out with my mentor and Rick James and whatnot. It was like. It was kind of like we all won when those guys got signed to Eminem and stuff like that. So definitely as soon as those guys really started popping, I made sure they were one of the first people that I reached out to and was like, look, I love what you guys are doing. I'm happy for you guys and I wanna work with you guys. And when they heard my music, it was a no brainer. It was like, yeah, you're at the same level as us. You know what I'm saying? It's not like we're doing you a favor or nothing like that. And our subject matter was the same. Our backgrounds were the same. So the chemistry, it just worked. So I've done a lot of work with those guys. But. Yeah, but Rick Hyde is actually. He was living in Atlanta at the time. I believe he still does. And he actually had me come down to Atlanta and shoot the music video down there. But. Yeah, but the song is called Dollar Bill, featuring me and Mick Hyde. And that'll be the first record we do today. [00:38:08] Speaker C: All right, let's check out Dollar Bill, then we'll be right back with Pea Gutter. [00:38:17] Speaker E: It's Ricky. Look back against the ropes. Muhammad in the 10th round, make a car to Poppy and his brother, get him sent down, get him off the boat, bring them bitches in town. And I'm charging 81 a piece. That's a 10. Brown buddies for the 80. [00:38:34] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:38:35] Speaker E: Got a nigga Wavy. You ever made so much money you made, you lazy screaming fuck, you pay me. You ever try and play me, I'll be laughing to the bank. Why they taking you to. Great. A hundred thousand this year. Next year I'm a double. That 100 shots yesterday today we gonna double back Grew up on the corner where it's hope with all the trouble at 30 shots I better get this sounding like some bubble wrap I ain't have to mumble rap still doing numbers on them at this rate I'm going It's going to be hard to stay humble on them Dollar dollar bill, y'all to the grave or to the snail bars do this forever if let me I dare y'all, it's Ricky I want. [00:39:09] Speaker B: That dollar dollar bill, y'all A young buck selling drugs and suck who never had much I want that dollar dollar bill, y'all Trying to get a clutch of what I could not touch I want that dollar dollar bill, y'all the court play me short Now I face incarceration I want that dollar dollar bill, y'all Life fast it shorty shouldn't be. [00:39:31] Speaker F: So I was in positions growing up I was a misfit until I hit the kitchen Whipping for the dope like Biscuit Started hitting licks of candy cane like it was Christmas snowing on the court Fiends needed my assistance Knew I would deliver Life alone about my business Bundles triple, double Michael Jordan Scotty Pippen started out with pitching Made a smooth transition Crossover county lines Now I'm in the new position no more hand in hand Cutting up the competition Picked up the weight in person and collecting up commissions right Never on consignment Always played a front that's why they like me I was 30 even when the friends tried to indict me Married to the game and the music was my mistress she excite me Praying karma don't come back to bite me I was seeing checks where before the shipments coming in with Nikes pumping like a reebok in the 90s in the trenches where you find me if they gave out awards, I win A grimy try to leave that state of mind behind me Here watch too many mothers lose their sons behind a homie pay my mother Never see them use white talk to outline. [00:40:30] Speaker B: Praise I want that dollar dollar bill, y'all A young buck selling drugs and such who never had much I want that dollar dollar bill, y'all Trying to get a clutch of what I could not touch I want that dollar dollar bill, y'all the court play me short Nine face incarcerations I want that dollar dollar bill, y'all Life fast it shorty. [00:40:52] Speaker F: Shouldn'T be so well just another boy from the hood I got Ricky with me and we both about that dope boy we cruising the city we from a place where Most of us never make it to 50 just to get a shiny neck piece they gonna pop you like a rice crystal If I catch a acting shady around my lady ain't a marshal that can save you I swear on my babies I ain't a killer this is what they made me look what I became God from a king on fire like Hades I'm paranoid don't hold it against me When I watch my friend kill his other friend While riding a ten speed I try to act like it doesn't affect me but my heart is cold Guess that's just my instincts trying to protect me with every hater it's the same old jazz they detest me cause I'm blowing money like Dizzy Gillespie I've been balling should have won an ESPY top 10 on sports center I've been riding this wave like a jet ski all this ice on me they gonna try to slide on me nice with a stick and a blade they compare me to Gretzky for the tips they try to chin check me now they laying in the penalty box don't ever disrespect me I got money coming incorrectly and you talking trash while I'm getting bags and they all hefty that's why your baby mama think I'm sexy She know the real from the fake so your streaming numbers don't impress me I want. [00:42:04] Speaker B: That dollar dollar bill, y'all A young buck selling drugs and such who never had much I want that dollar dollar bill, y'all trying to get a clutch of what I could not touch I want that dollar dollar bill, y'all the court play me short Now I face incarceration I want that dollar dollar bill, y'all life faster Shorty shouldn't be so. [00:42:26] Speaker A: Rough. [00:42:37] Speaker C: All right, that was Dollar Bill Pea gutter. And that one you said that's like the. A more recent single. But if we're. You know, I've been thinking. You know, we were talking about 2004, right? Hood life and the difference between, you know, the 20 year gap. But I guess I want to kind of go back and wrap up the story of hood life in 2004 before we move on. [00:42:59] Speaker A: Oh, no. 100%. So we kind of talked about, you know, everything it. It took and what I was able to accomplish as far as being able to make a physical product that was sold in the stores. And I brought. I purposely brought up Music Shack because for a lot of local artists, even though they were helping out artists all over the country for. For local artists in the 518. At that time, a lot of them felt like Music Shack was the finish line. Like, that was. That was the Grammys for them. You know what I'm saying? Or that was getting signed to Roc. A fella for them is like, if I can just get a physical product made and actually get it into music, Shaq, I can die today. And I've done everything that I want to do in music. And like I said, because of the people who I aspire to be like. Like a Master P and stuff like that, it was like, that's barely even. [00:43:58] Speaker C: The start of it. [00:43:58] Speaker A: Yeah, I was like, that's great that that happened. But like, nah, like, I'm not satisfied. This is not. This is not the ceiling for me. I know I have a lot, you know, more to do. So I actually did. Once I had it in the stores, I was like, okay, now, so now it's ready for step two, which is now I need to promote this thing. So I was actually able to hook up with. I don't even. I don't know what. I guess it's just a way to. Best way to call them a community. That was. That was out here and it was. It was actually helping, you know, local artists who were wanting to be independent and push their own music. It was. It was eclectic. So it was. It was called Pitch Control Music. So. Yeah, so shout out to, you know, jb. Dirty Moses. Yeah, And Seth Static. Yeah, those guys. [00:44:52] Speaker C: He's appearing on my band's record. [00:44:54] Speaker A: Okay. [00:44:55] Speaker C: Is coming out in a couple. Couple months. [00:44:57] Speaker A: So. Yeah, so he. Like, jb. It was like me and him were, like, releasing projects at the same time and were in Music Shack at the same time and had CDs, you know, right up at the counter, you know, right next to each other. So we was kind of. We were in the trenches, like, at the same time, like. Like building this thing. And they were instrumental in helping me go from just having the music in the stores to actually being able, you know, to book shows and go out to the public and. And promote that way. Because for me, that's always been the best way for me to sell my music. Has always been in person. [00:45:29] Speaker C: Right. [00:45:30] Speaker A: You know, it's. It's good to have your stuff. Like you said, we're talking about 2024 right now. It's good to have, you know, your stuff on the Internet and put your stuff on the Internet and stuff like that. But that realness and that connection versus people always are so happy. I can't say happy. They're just Like, I guess, like, pleasant. I'll say, like, pleasantly pleased that the person that they meet in person with me is the same person that I am on the Internet, right? And like I said, it's another one of those things, you know, that. That's rare and it's. It's appreciated. I'll say. They appreciate it. So. So going back, you know, doing, you know, shows with those guys, I like pitch control and stuff like that. Like, that was also, for me, it helped me really own my skills in this area as far as being a live performer. So one of the roadblocks that I actually ended up running into, it wasn't about, like, actually making the product. It was actually from a health standpoint. I was in a meeting with pitch control music, and, you know, they were kind of just. It was like an introductory meeting, like, telling me, like, you know, like, who they are, you know what I'm saying, Like, what their community is about and stuff. And, man, I'm in this meeting and I'm trying. I'm trying to, like, concentrate and retain the information that they're giving me, but I'm. I'm having, like, this unbelievable pain, like, creep. Like, I was. I think I believe I could start it in my back, and then it start, like, creeping over my shoulder and then, like, down my chest. And it's like, the longer the meeting is going, I'm, like, sinking, like, down into my chair, like, lower and lower, like, not. Not letting anybody know what's going on. But I'm just. I'm. I'm. I'm trying to. To. To have, like, the hugest threshold for this amount of pain that I'm having and just, like, get through this meeting and that, you know, that night, obviously, the plane got, you know, worse and worse until, like, the next morning, I was on the floor in my living room. Now I'm just, like, doubled over in pain, and I can't move, and I'm not. And I can't hardly breathe because the pain in my chest is so bad. It's not even let me take, like, full breaths no more. And I'm like, I think I'm dying. So, you know, luckily, somehow I was able to get ahold of my girlfriend, and she came home and saw me on the living room floor. And, you know, Lucky was able to get me to the hospital and things like that. Had no idea. The whole time that I was in that meeting, I had. I had a blood clot in both of my lungs. [00:48:24] Speaker C: Holy shit. [00:48:25] Speaker A: And they were literally, like. They were like, if they don't get you to the hospital any second, like, 15 minutes later than what they did. Like, you wouldn't be here. And that. That gave me a totally different perspective on what making a body of work really meant. Like, the album was already finished. It was already out there. It was on the shelves. And I'm like, that could have been my last message to the world, but it would have been something that lived on way after I was gone. And it kind of gave me Making me Making music and making art and making songs. It gave it a totally different level of gravity and meaning to what am I actually putting out into the world and how do I want to be remembered? But I remember after that, like, you know, thank God, you know, 20 years later, we're having this conversation right now. So obviously, you know, things improved. But for me, it was. It was really like, I have to not only take the music business itself seriously, but what I'm saying on these records, you know, has to have more of a meaning than just something cool to say on a record or just getting on the radio or in the clubs. I really want to leave something here that I'm proud of. So it was like that type of clarity, like, in that moment. So. And then the urgency as well, of, you know, tomorrow not being promised, it also put a different battery in my back as well. It's like, look, I don't know, you know, I'm recording next record and, you know, all these aspirations that I have for the music business, is all these things going to happen for me or not? I've got to hit the ground running. And that's really what I did. Like I said, that urgency was way different. So I didn't really listen to the doctor as much as I probably should, where there was rest, and I went right back into the studio. So now I'm recording records with blood clots still in my lungs. I can't even hardly get up the stairs to the studio. I'm out doing shows, I'm performing on stage. People don't know I'm on stage performing because the. Because just because you go into the hospital, the blood clots don't go away. They put you on medicine. The medicine does not make the blood clot go away. All it's doing is it's just thinning out your blood enough so that your body can dissolve the blood clot, but the blood clot is still there. So the blood clot was actually lodged in between my lungs and my rib cage. So anytime that I would, my lungs would expand it's pressing the blood clot up against my rib cage and that's what was causing. Causing the pain. But I'm going doing shows with pitch control music. And I'm on stage yelling at the top of my lungs and I got blood clots in my lungs. Just knowing it's like whatever I'm gonna do, like, I gotta do it right now. Cause I don't know how long this is gonna last. So thank God we're talking about this 20 years later. And 2024 is the official 20 year anniversary of hood life. [00:51:44] Speaker C: That's awesome. So I don't want to cut it super short, but I do have. I do have another guest coming in, so. And this has been just a fucking fantastic conversation. But you know, the best thing about it is that we only got so far into the story is that come back and we'll do another one. But before we go, I do want to hear another song. So what do you have for us for this one? [00:52:06] Speaker A: All right, great. So, yeah, so my latest release that I put out, and we have a music video to be shot for that one as well. This record is called Making a Band. Excuse me. And it actually features another artist who's recently signed by Benny the Butcher to Black Soprano family. His name is Flames Dot Malik. He's out of Rochester, New York. And that was. It was actually produced by a good friend of mine. His name is Vinny Idol. He's considered the godfather of street music. He's out of Queens, New York. He's done. I know the Locks are actually going to be performing at the Palace Theater on November 1st. And he's the one who produced the majority of all the tracks, like on all their mixtapes and stuff like that. So it's definitely a record I'm very proud of. And yeah, it's called Making the Band featuring me and Flames Out Malik. [00:52:57] Speaker C: All right, let's listen to Making the Band and we'll be right back to wrap it up with Pea Gutter. [00:53:23] Speaker D: All those New York City trips Coming home with a quarter brick got me paid but it wasn't worth it so I called it quits I had a newborn my girl got thick milking her tits she was used to eating good now with snow stripping her grips what do I do now looking at my new child I can't raise a son if I'm sitting in the pen Now I know people doing life getting old and see now if I didn't make a change that's where I would be now working 9 to 5 got me feeling like a slave but would you rather have a job or lay up in the grave? I have fears of being broke had to find a legal way to make money Flip on top of money I already made Every day I'm hustling I push it to the limit don't want to talk about it if there ain't no money in it when it comes down to the spinach I need all of my percentage I did it on my owner I'm the captain and lieutenant Every foreign car you see me drive I didn't rent it when you see that barcode on the window they pretending fake it till you make it Now I wouldn't recommend it Kick it with some real niggas Then you understand why we always get offended Invisible said the only set I claim I just want the bands like a wedding ring I don't want no fans I don't want no fans I just want the fans I just want the bands I just want the bands I just want the bands I just want the bands I just want the bands I don't want no fans I don't want no fans I just want the band I push forward, no looking back Once I'm moonwalking I kill tracks and throw them inside of new coffins I'm through talking unless you pay me like Luke Walton Green on me like KG when he moved to Boston Getting money is what we do often Chain flooded with cold stones like Steve Austin New Porsche, got a long nose like a blue dolphin if you a snake around me you better use caution no cap, I'm winning but had a few losses and in the streets I earned respect from a few bosses When I was trapping Police sirens would get me nauseous Now I only get butterflies when the girl is gorgeous giving me head Inside my corner office my life got better when I took better offers Money clean like good china I eat off it I pull up in the ride and they ask me what the cost is if you don't know and you don't need it and I ain't even saying that to be conceded rich know the price and know I didn't lease it See, whatever's understood don't have to be repeated Going up and up a hill A couldn't see it in my hood only drug dealers had new Adidas, Air Jordans, Fela suits and Nike sneakers I couldn't sleep Bas bumping from the car speakers wake me up at night Followed by the smell of reefer Now I'm baking and I got more Franklins than A reefer feds watching cause they think I'm still living fat Graduated from the streets no cap and gam school of hard knocks try to knock me down Prince of the gutter and I got the crown Living out the dreams of a ghetto chap I just hope they feel a kid no pedophile invisible set the only set I claim I just want the bands like a wedding I don't want no fans I don't want no fans I just want the fans I just want the bands I just want the bands I just want the bands I just want the bands I just want the bands I don't want no fans I don't want no fans I just want. [00:56:47] Speaker G: The bands Player call a time out life is real Live later crying out you get the chills think about the body count the pill ain't real buddy still hated Brody tripping, thinking Kodak black black soprano family I'm the gremlin what is hope When I have bad dope with good intentions with tranquilizer I put the horse on it the old pistons I'm a survivor a COVID 19 and the trenches 585 hot headed and cold save all the small talk what's the ticket I could cook cocaine all the I want to is my kitchen so nobody, nobody with my kitchen feel like. [00:57:45] Speaker C: All right, that was Megan, the band. And I want to thank you so much not only for taking time out of your day to sit down and do this too, but, like, for the story. Like, this has just been a really interesting conversation and again, I want to have you back at some point and we'll continue the talk. But for now, before we wrap it up, I want to just give you a chance to say what I refer to as your gratitude. So microphone is all yours. [00:58:12] Speaker A: So, yeah, so definitely want to give shout outs to my, my other companies and businesses that I have my hands on or have partnerships with. So I want to give a shout out to just down at Fresh and fly clothing at 13 S. North Pearl St. I partnered with him for a long time now. So, you know, that's the best place to go to get, you know, get your fit right. You know, they enhance your swag. So, yeah, you'll be able to get, you know, top of the line clothing and sneakers from him. Speaking of clothing, I do have my own clothing line as well. It's called Home Bake Clothing. We have our own, you know, page on Instagram and Facebook and Twitter. So check that out. Recipes for success. You already know that's the motto and Just recently, a lot of people don't know what this is about me is that I do dabble in the kitchen a little bit. And on a. On a legal tip, yeah, I do dabble in the kitchen a little bit. And I actually started selling my own sauce that I developed. Some people put in a category as a wing sauce. It's not necessarily a barbecue sauce, but I tell people, not just me, everybody who's tasted it, like, I put it on everything, it tastes good on everything. So, yeah, so that's called smack sauce. And that'll also be available on the home Bake clothing website. So I encourage anybody that wants to get in touch with me. Instagram, Twitter, Facebook, it's all the same Tagline. It's just PGutter Online, PGU T T E R Online. And also got to give one more shout out to my manager in music, Tony De Niro. He's also the business manager for Black Soprano Family Records and also big sports firm, which is the sports agency that Benny the Butcher has started. So Deion Dawkins, I know, is one of their clients from the Buffalo Bills. But shout out to. Yeah, definitely shout out to Tony. He's been very instrumental in helping me put together a lot of these major moves that I'm making right now. But, yeah, please go to YouTube. It's PGTV on YouTube for all of the latest, you know, music videos that we drop. And also Paperchaser.com is the. Is the official YouTube outlet that distributes our music videos as well. [01:00:46] Speaker C: All right, so he is P. Gutter. I am Andy scullen, this is unsigned 518 and I'll see you on the road. [01:00:54] Speaker A: Peace. [01:00:55] Speaker C: Unsigned 518 is produced and hosted by me, Andy Scullen. New episodes are available every week wherever you stream podcasts. If you'd like to help support the show, please like and subscribe wherever you are listening. Or you could buy me a [email protected] unsigned 518. If you would like to advertise on the show, send me an email at unsigned518gmail.com and to be a guest on the show, reach out to me through Instagram at unsigned518. Take care of one another and I'll see you next week.